Curious Business: Insights for B2B Growth

With ecosystems increasingly outperforming standalone firms, marketing leaders’ key skills may lie in their ability to get their organisations to influence, persuade, enable, and collaborate. In an ever-noisier and more complex market, the companies that can co-create, communicate and change to bring customers value tend to be the winners - but it requires a very different approach.  
In this episode, former three-time global CMO Leeya Hendricks makes the case for platform thinking in B2B marketing, where value is co-created across networks of customers, partners and complementors rather than pushed through linear channels. 
She shares insights from her new book The Platform Playbook and explains why the CMO is uniquely positioned to orchestrate ecosystem growth - connecting product, technology, data and partners around shared value.
What We Cover:
Why "platforms over pipelines" is the future of B2B marketing
The three misconceptions holding organisations back from platform thinking
A practical four-dimension framework for operating marketing as a platform
Why the funnel was always just a convenient model, not reality
How to measure ecosystem health beyond traditional marketing metrics
The unexpected cultural transformation that happens when organisations embrace co-creation
Key Takeaways
Platforms aren't technology - they're business models and systems of value creation
Customers trust ecosystems, not isolated brands
Sharing multiplies value in ecosystems, even though leaders fear it dilutes value
The CMO's role is to make silos more permeable, not destroy them
Think long-term stickiness, not short-term campaigns
 
About Leeya Hendricks
Leeya is the author of The Platform Playbook (Palgrave Macmillan), Managing Director of Hark Consultants, and has served in three global CMO roles across major technology companies including IBM and Oracle. She lectures in digital ecosystems and orchestration, and runs My Barre Vibes, a digital-first fitness platform.
 
Connect with Leeya on LinkedIn:https://www.linkedin.com/in/dr-leeya-hendricks-120b95a/
 
Order The Platform Playbook (affiliate link):https://uk.bookshop.org/a/15792/9783032080301
 
Find out more about My Barre Vibes:https://www.mybarrevibes.com/
--Thanks for listening. Curious Business is here to bring you insights, experiences and ideas to help you think differently about your business and marketing. My name is Stephen Morris and I help start-ups and scale-ups gain clarity, take action and ignite momentum in their marketing and pipeline. Like to know more? Book a discovery call:https://www.curiousbusiness.co.uk/discovery/Or sign-up to 'The Prompt' my monthly newsletter:https://www.curiousbusiness.co.uk/signup/If you'd like to talk about how podcasts can build reach, enhance authority and fuel your pipeline, visit:www.curiousbusiness.co.uk.

What’s it like to be a real legacy business? One with a heritage going back over 100 years? How do you navigate new methods, classic products and changing tastes? This is a masterclass in knowing who you are, who your customers are and what you’re about.
Andy Valentine is a food industry veteran who now feels like the proverbial "kid in the sweet shop". He’s responsible for developing direct, B2B and private-label channels for a business that combines traditional handcrafted techniques with state-of-the-art facilities.
Stockley's was founded in 1918 in Accrington, Lancashire and has managed to navigate tastes, trends, the second world war, the demise of Woolworths and, more recently, a number of different owners. But how far and fast should you go to open up new channels in a £6bn market dominated by multinationals?
 
Listen to this episode to discover:
The journey from humble premises to 21st century manufacturer
The channels and formats bringing new customers to Stockley's
Where and what the biggest opportunities are, and how to prioritise
Why being a relative minnow might just be their greatest advantage
What’s the most divisive product in confectionery
 
Find out more and buy online:https://stockleys-sweets.co.uk
 
Connect with Andy on LinkedIn:https://www.linkedin.com/in/andy-valentine-1752671/
 
--Thanks for listening. Curious Business is here to bring you insights, experiences and ideas to help you think differently about your business and marketing. My name is Stephen Morris and I help start-ups and scale-ups gain clarity, take action and ignite momentum in their marketing and pipeline. Like to know more? Book a discovery call:https://www.curiousbusiness.co.uk/discovery/Or sign-up to 'The Prompt' my monthly newsletter:https://www.curiousbusiness.co.uk/signup/If you'd like to talk about how podcasts can build reach, enhance authority and fuel your pipeline, visit:www.curiousbusiness.co.uk.

After eight years as Head of Marketing for Red Bull UK and Europe, Huib van Bockel walked away to build something the industry told him couldn't work - an energy drink made entirely from nature, with 60% less sugar, and no artificial ingredients. Every manufacturer he approached said it wasn't commercially viable, but he found one willing to try. Today, Tenzing is the third-biggest energy drink brand in Tesco, and number one in London universities and climbing, proving that you can take on the "big dogs" of the soft drinks world.
Former Red Bull marketer Hub Van Bockel tells the story of founding Tenzing, the low‑sugar, all natural ingredient energy drink inspired by Himalayan brews and named with the blessing of Tenzing Norgay’s family. The episode covers Huib's idea, starting-up, early business development and pivoting on flavour, building and growing with communities, retail partnerships, winning major listings (including Tesco, Waitrose, Sainsbury's, Morrisons, ASDA) and minority investment by Heineken.
Listen to this episode to find out:
Why every soft drink from apple juice to Red Bull has 11% sugar — and why Huib refused to follow the formula
The overlooked advantage small brands have that Coca-Cola and Monster can never replicate, no matter what they spend
How Tenzing grew by embedding in communities and the next-generation for who believe that "run clubs are the new nightclubs"
The winning go-to-market approach Huib wishes he'd used far more when starting out
 
Find out more about Tenzing, buy online:https://tenzingnaturalenergy.com/
Connect with Huib on LinkedIn:https://www.linkedin.com/in/huib-van-bockel-8454834/
 
Books mentioned and recommended in this episode (affiliate links): 
Daniel Kahneman ‘Thinking Fast and Slow’ https://uk.bookshop.org/a/15792/9780141033570
Richard Branson ‘Losing my Virginity’https://uk.bookshop.org/a/15792/9780753519554
Phil Knight ‘Show Dog’https://uk.bookshop.org/a/15792/9781471146725
 
--Thanks for listening. Curious Business is here to bring you insights, experiences and ideas to help you think differently about your business and marketing. My name is Stephen Morris and I help start-ups and scale-ups gain clarity, take action and ignite momentum in their marketing and pipeline. Like to know more? Book a discovery call:https://www.curiousbusiness.co.uk/discovery/Or sign-up to 'The Prompt' my monthly newsletter:https://www.curiousbusiness.co.uk/signup/If you'd like to talk about how podcasts can build reach, enhance authority and fuel your pipeline, visit:www.curiousbusiness.co.uk.

How much can we influence people with advertising? What’s the best way to understand and model buyer behaviour? How should we set about growing market share?
James Hankins has worked in agency, consultant and client roles, tackling these very questions. In this episode, he challenges marketing myths and woolly thinking, and explains why understanding your market matters more than chasing funnels. The conversation blends practical strategy with behavioural insight to help marketers - and leaders - make better decisions.
I worked at the same media agency as James in the 2000s (Walker Media). Since then, his insights have regularly appeared in the marketing press, at the IPA, and in my LinkedIn feed. He’s a veteran of the UK's major media and advertising groups and, more recently, Global VP Marketing Strategy and Planning for Sage. He’s also the creator of the Share of Search and Hankins Hexagon models. 
Listen to this episode to learn:
Why market dynamics are the gravity upon which strategy and execution must be built
How Share of Search works and how it gives the rest of us valuable market share data
Why funnels are misleading and how the Hankins Hexagon is better for marketers looking to influence buyers   
The impact of slowing SaaS growth on businesses like Sage
How brands, influence and ‘share of model’ will likely play out in the world of ChatGPT  
All that, and this episode features the podcast’s first mention of devil worship.
 
The Hankins Hexagon:https://www.marketingweek.com/forget-funnels-new-model-path-to-purchase/
If you’re a WARC subscriber, the full paper is here:https://www.warc.com/content/paywall/article/warc-exclusive/the-hankins-hexagon-a-new-practical-model-for-the-path-to-purchase/en-gb/137888?
More about Share of Search and how to calculate yours:https://www.myshareofsearch.com
Connect with James on LinkedIn:https://www.linkedin.com/in/james-cp-hankins/
Read James' blog:https://theeqplanner.wordpress.com
--Thanks for listening. Curious Business is here to bring you insights, experiences and ideas to help you think differently about your business and marketing. My name is Stephen Morris and I help start-ups and scale-ups gain clarity, take action and ignite momentum in their marketing and pipeline. Like to know more? Book a discovery call:https://www.curiousbusiness.co.uk/discovery/Or sign-up to 'The Prompt' my monthly newsletter:https://www.curiousbusiness.co.uk/signup/If you'd like to talk about how podcasts can build reach, enhance authority and fuel your pipeline, visit:www.curiousbusiness.co.uk.

Chris Brogan shares some brutally honest insights about leadership, growth and being helpful. He's a self-proclaimed expert at failing, but what does that mean? And how can leaders learn from it to keep their organisations flexible and effective even as they grow at speed?
Ten-time author, executive coach, strategic advisor, writer, photographer and co-host of the internet’s Backpack Show and Playing For Time, Chris is a master communicator. As Chief of Staff at Appfire, he most recently helped steer the B2B SaaS company from $10m to $275m of ARR (annually recurring revenue). Despite this, he claims he's never been ‘capable or qualified’ for anything he's done professionally. 
This is a conversation packed with wisdom, experience and smart thinking. And a very dry reference to the Red Hot Chilli Peppers that went right over my head at the time. Listen to discover:
what Chris thinks is crucial about failure and failing,
the traits that make for great (and not so great) leaders,
why companies lose their elasticity as they grow - and what you can do about it,
what he wants to do for the rest of his life,
why he’s learning to code,
some excellent tips for cold email marketing, and 
the philosophical lessons we should take from the Red Hot Chilli Peppers.
Connect with Chris on LinkedIn:https://www.linkedin.com/in/cbrogan/
Sign-up for his newsletter:https://chrisbrogan.com/#newsletter
 
Check out that Anthony Kiedis/Red Hot Chilli Peppers reference:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8DyziWtkfBw
 
The report about the gender difference in confidence when it comes to apply for roles:https://hbr.org/2014/08/why-women-dont-apply-for-jobs-unless-theyre-100-qualified
 
And due credit to The Adaptavist Group's Jari Worsley for the story about his dad training spreadsheet users back in the day. Read more here:https://bit.ly/4onTjXJ
 
Further reading:
Chris Brogan ‘Social Media 101’ (affiliate link)https://uk.bookshop.org/a/15792/9780470621004
 
Chris Brogan & Julien Smith ‘The Impact Equation’ (affiliate link)https://uk.bookshop.org/a/15792/9780670922406
 
Ryan Holliday ‘ Ego Is The Enemy’ (affiliate link) https://uk.bookshop.org/a/15792/9781781257029
 
Chris Whipple ‘The Gatekeepers’ (affiliate link)https://amzn.eu/d/1m2wNHl
 
--Thanks for listening. Curious Business is here to bring you insights, experiences and ideas to help you think differently about your business and marketing. My name is Stephen Morris and I help start-ups and scale-ups gain clarity, take action and ignite momentum in their marketing and pipeline. Like to know more? Book a discovery call:https://www.curiousbusiness.co.uk/discovery/Or sign-up to 'The Prompt' my monthly newsletter:https://www.curiousbusiness.co.uk/signup/If you'd like to talk about how podcasts can build reach, enhance authority and fuel your pipeline, visit:www.curiousbusiness.co.uk.

In this episode of the Curious Business podcast, we meet Ella McKay, founder of Fatso. The provocatively named chocolate brand is bringing unapologetic indulgence to dark chocolate and putting ethical sourcing at its core. Ella shares the story of her journey from corporate marketeer to entrepreneurial risk-taker, and provides invaluable insights into effective business strategy and how to use consumer research.
If you’re building a brand in a crowded market, you’ll learn how being provocative and staying true to your values helps you cut through the noise. Sometimes you need to break the rules to make an impact. Hear how Ella established partnerships with cacao farmers in Colombia and why she believes gut instinct, learning by doing, and calculated risk-taking trumps analytics, especially for small businesses trying to innovate and challenge.
Tune in to hear all about:
The story behind the provocative brand name
Building ethical supply chains with Colombian cacao farmers
Navigating retailer relationships and learning when not to take ‘no’ as an answer
The production disaster that nearly derailed everything
Plans for new formats and products, and making the dark chocolate category sexy
The skills and training that best prepared her for the challenges
 
This episode is perfect for founders, brand builders, food entrepreneurs, and anyone who believes business should be built on passion, ethics, and a healthy disregard for doing things the conventional way.
 
Buy online from Delli Market:https://delli.market/collections/fatso
Buy online from Holly & Co:https://holly.co/storefront/fatso
Buy online and read more about Fatso ‘from farm to face’:https://sofatso.com/shop/
Find your nearest retailer :https://sofatso.com/stockists/
To buy the book ‘Thanks For The Feedback’ (recommended in the podcast):https://uk.bookshop.org/a/15792/9780670922635 (affiliate link)
And visit the Curious Business bookshop:https://uk.bookshop.org/shop/curiousbusiness (affiliate link)
--Thanks for listening. Curious Business is here to bring you insights, experiences and ideas to help you think differently about your business and marketing. My name is Stephen Morris and I help start-ups and scale-ups gain clarity, take action and ignite momentum in their marketing and pipeline. Like to know more? Book a discovery call:https://www.curiousbusiness.co.uk/discovery/Or sign-up to 'The Prompt' my monthly newsletter:https://www.curiousbusiness.co.uk/signup/If you'd like to talk about how podcasts can build reach, enhance authority and fuel your pipeline, visit:www.curiousbusiness.co.uk.

How do you turn a 15-person tech shop into a £300m global powerhouse? Is it instinct – or experience? What are the tough calls that fuel B2B growth? And how do you keep ahead and keep pushing forward?
Over the last 15 years, Simon Haighton-Williams, CEO of The Adaptavist Group, has led the company to annual revenues over £300 million. On a mission to make business work better, the Group now comprises over 1,000 employees in more than 15 countries, helping companies gain a competitive edge through its software and consultancy services. A staggering 57 million users work with its products, solutions, and services, including more than half of the Fortune 500.
Tune into this leadership podcast to hear:
The formative experiences that shaped Simon’s personal vision of business
The key transitions in scaling from 15 people to a £300m group
Why calculated risks are the only path to growth
How systems thinking and empathy are the fundamentals
Why thriving means being comfortable outside your comfort zone
Learn more about The Adaptavist Group and check the Digital Etiquette reports: www.theadaptavistgroup.com/
Connect with Simon on LinkedIn:https://www.linkedin.com/in/simonwilliams/
--Thanks for listening. Curious Business is here to bring you insights, experiences and ideas to help you think differently about your business and marketing. My name is Stephen Morris and I help start-ups and scale-ups gain clarity, take action and ignite momentum in their marketing and pipeline. Like to know more? Book a discovery call:https://www.curiousbusiness.co.uk/discovery/Or sign-up to 'The Prompt' my monthly newsletter:https://www.curiousbusiness.co.uk/signup/If you'd like to talk about how podcasts can build reach, enhance authority and fuel your pipeline, visit:www.curiousbusiness.co.uk.

How do we move beyond AI hype to take advantage of the real opportunities for business strategy? Who’s using AI well already, how does it reshape reality and who can we learn from? What happens when AI upsets your value chain and how can you maintain your competitive advantage? 
In this episode of Curious Business, Stephen Morris welcomes Sangeet Paul Choudary, renowned author and business strategist to Fortune 500 companies. They explore the themes in Sangeet’s latest book - Reshuffle - and dive into what AI really means for individuals, businesses and industries. Fuelled by keen insights and profound understanding, Sangeet highlights the foundational shifts occurring from task-centric to system-centric views, and gives leaders a framework to rethink their strategies and reimagine their organisations to take advantage.
Listen to this episode to find out:
How AI is shifting focus and why we should be looking beyond optimising tasks to reimagining entire systems
Why the hype around GenAI isn’t unique but why it might, however, be distracting us from what really matters
The often surprising exemplars who are using AI to restack the odds in their favour, and the two reasons imcumbents typically struggle
How AI turns previously scarce information into abundant knowledge, and how to find value in what is scarce and defensible
What skills are crucial for the transition to an AI-driven economy - and what can we learn about commoditisation from performing magicians?
 
Buy the book (affiliate link):
https://amzn.eu/d/dw4CfN4
 
Connect with Sangeet on LinkedIn:
https://www.linkedin.com/in/sangeetpaul
 
Sign-up for updates on Reshuffle and Sangeet’s thinking on Substack:
https://platforms.substack.com/
--Thanks for listening. Curious Business is here to bring you insights, experiences and ideas to help you think differently about your business and marketing. My name is Stephen Morris and I help start-ups and scale-ups gain clarity, take action and ignite momentum in their marketing and pipeline. Like to know more? Book a discovery call:https://www.curiousbusiness.co.uk/discovery/Or sign-up to 'The Prompt' my monthly newsletter:https://www.curiousbusiness.co.uk/signup/If you'd like to talk about how podcasts can build reach, enhance authority and fuel your pipeline, visit:www.curiousbusiness.co.uk.

What do you do when people won’t pay a sustainable price for the high quality product you’ve worked so hard to produce? How do you get started in your career and find your passion? The co-founder of Hive Mind Mead tells all.
Kit Newell, co-founder of the Great Taste Award-winning honey drinks brand, shares how his career in advertising and design prepared him for entrepreneurship - and the key skills that helped him build a business stocked in over 50 M&S stores.
Listen now to hear all about: 
The journey from advertising, design and product management to an award-winning ‘modern mead’ business
How (and why) Hive Mind pivoted from high-quality honey to a modern honey-based drinks business
The interplay between intuition and analytics, and the main thing Kit would do differently if the business started again
How they’ve built the business, adding stockists and distribution, and what Kit spends most of his time doing
Why they found themselves listening to heavy metal till sunrise four or five nights a week?
 
🔗 Explore Hive Mind Mead and buy online: hivemindmead.com
 
🛒 Find them in M&S (until end of September): See locations
--Thanks for listening. Curious Business is here to bring you insights, experiences and ideas to help you think differently about your business and marketing. My name is Stephen Morris and I help start-ups and scale-ups gain clarity, take action and ignite momentum in their marketing and pipeline. Like to know more? Book a discovery call:https://www.curiousbusiness.co.uk/discovery/Or sign-up to 'The Prompt' my monthly newsletter:https://www.curiousbusiness.co.uk/signup/If you'd like to talk about how podcasts can build reach, enhance authority and fuel your pipeline, visit:www.curiousbusiness.co.uk.

Is communication a soft skill or is the most powerful tool in your armoury? In this episode of Curious Business, Nima Abu Wardeh, author of The Brilliant Communicator argues that it can easily be the difference between success and failure.
Do you deliver your message so in a way that engages your target audience? Do you resonate with what they care about so your message takes root? Speaking from her experiences as a presenter, moderator, trainer and  broadcast journalist with a background in medical engineering, Nima shares crucial tips and business insights for better communication.
Listen now to learn from her "brilliant communicator" framework, the foundations that set up you up for success. She recounts real-world examples from her time presenting on BBC World and FT TV and explains the ways that people often fail to connect.
Whether you're an aspiring entrepreneur or a seasoned corporate executive, pitching to investors or inspiring your team, you'll learn how to elevate your communication skills and realise your version of success. Tune in to hear:
The secrets of standing out and seducing the people you want to reach (with your ideas) 
How school conditions us to mis-communicate
The misalignment that cost NASA $125m
How companies fumble their media appearances and misunderstand their goals
Prep, focus and land your message for maximum impact
Grab 'The Brilliant Communicator' book:- at Bookshop.org (affiliate link, supports local bookstores)
Get weekly tips from Nima, sign up for her newsletter:- at www.thebrilliantcommunicator.com
Connect with Nima: - on LinkedIn
--Thanks for listening. Curious Business is here to bring you insights, experiences and ideas to help you think differently about your business and marketing. My name is Stephen Morris and I help start-ups and scale-ups gain clarity, take action and ignite momentum in their marketing and pipeline. Like to know more? Book a discovery call:https://www.curiousbusiness.co.uk/discovery/Or sign-up to 'The Prompt' my monthly newsletter:https://www.curiousbusiness.co.uk/signup/If you'd like to talk about how podcasts can build reach, enhance authority and fuel your pipeline, visit:www.curiousbusiness.co.uk.